My interview with Bobi Wine's international lawyer, Robert Amsterdam
by Melissa Chemam
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| Photo: Reuters |
The campaign from especially the opposition, but especially Bobi Wine as we call him, has been very dynamic, but it's also been very difficult. How have you been followed and what was the most worrying according to your experience of covering these elections?
Let's be really clear. This is a man who faces death each day. I was first brought in years ago when Museveni tried to kill Bobby by shooting into his car. Years and years ago. And Bobby was then brutally tortured and held in jail, uh, in a town called Arua, Uganda. And from that time to today, and this is a, you know, a number of years, a long period of time, Bobby's life has been in danger. And unlike many, he did not flee his country. He is representative of a population that mostly are under the age of 18 and desperate for change. He is the symbol of change. He is the symbol of youth, not only in Uganda but in Africa. He is an important and emblematic symbol of the fight of this generation to be heard, and for the dinosaurs of previous generations to step out of the way. The world should start to be run by people who have to live in its future, not by those who created a pretty horrendous past in Uganda.
The campaigner is now finished and many organisations have denounced the repression, the level of brutality. Um, how do you expect the vote itself to take place. I hear a lot of Ugandans are afraid to make a choice to. Even maybe to go out. I imagine that the candidate encouraged them to to be courageous and to believe that a change will come in Uganda. But how do you feel this can impact the vote and the result?
Of course it's going to impact the vote. The authorities have cut off the internet. They've divided Kampala into 14 military districts. There's a massive, unprecedented mobilisation of the military. It's absurd and obscene. And I've already had calls from people within the government, who are highly confident of the outcome and are already reaching out to me, because they're worried about what the response will be of another stolen election. So the government is gearing up to steal another election and deprive Uganda of its vote.
And can you be ready if that is the case? Is there a legal challenges that are in place and that can make you confident that Ugandans can get what they deserve, or how difficult is it to go through?
I also represent the opposition in Tanzania. Thousands of whom were brutally murdered in another stolen election in this part of Africa. So I would be lying if I expressed great confidence in the ability to remove a military dictator.
But at the same time, before a vote, however jaded it may be, I'm not going to make these comments. I'm going to pray for Bobby's safety and for the safety of those with the courage to vote for him and hope against hope that Museveni and his dynasty, because he's going to try to put his son in after he's finished, allow reason and the will of the populace to prevail.
And you said it yourself. Bobi wine is a special figure. For once, in such a context, you have a figure that is trustworthy, strong, leading a remarkable campaign and that will stay. So do you think that's what Ugandans should also see, a future where politicians like him can emerge in Uganda and beyond?
He's an inspirational figure, as is Tundu Lissu in Tanzania, who's now in solitary, who after being shot 16 times in a prior election. I think these martyrs and wine, Bobi wine is a martyrs, having suffered through torture and false imprisonment, and God knows what fate is in his future. These men are are are heroes of of real democracy, not the the bogus crap we see in Europe of failed leaders and tired policies. These are men of vision who are trying to bring their people out of desperate circumstances.
Every expert of the region is is worried about, you know, contamination. And on the other side of Africa, in West Africa and the Sahel, democracy is also under attack. What is your advice for parties who still have to wait for months, if not years, if not decades, to be able to express?
The first thing we have to do is condemn the African Union for living in the past for making corrupt pacts of unqualified autocrats. We need somewhere in Africa to have moral suasion, and the African Union needs to be a light and not a dim reminder of the past. And, you know, we have great political figures in parts of Africa who are doing their best. Some of them I've come to know through a life in Africa. I'm privileged to act for the DRC and recognise a leader at the DRC who has tried his damnedest to, uh, fight, uh, in the people's corner against, uh, an absolutely predatory Rwanda that is the darling of the West. And there's just a tremendous amount of inequality and despair that we need to we need to turn around.
And all of us who have invested parts of our lives in Africa, we need to not let another Ugandan election be stolen. And we need to, you know, raise our voices. And, you know, with what's happening today in Iran. The silence of the West is shocking. You've had these thousands of marches about various political causes, and nobody's in the streets. They're killing protesters in Tehran, and there's nothing. So, there's we have heroes of democracy dying every day in silence.
These movements are not going anywhere. And Bobi Wine himself has promised there would be marches. There would be protests if the election is stolen, can we be confident that people are going to be safe?
Absolutely not. There's no confidence. You have a military that's corrupt and out of control. You know, I don't lie. There's no confidence. People have every legitimate right to fear for their lives. In a country that has no claim to democracy and no claim to rule of law when it comes to elections.
If anything changed, Uganda could be an example for for many. Most Ugandans have only known Museveni. So could could that could that be possible? Basically, could we believe in a victory, at least for one day?
As I said, I will never get a bet against a popular vote, no matter how hijacked I fear. So let's wait and see. You know, my hopes and prayers are with the people of Uganda in this fateful 48 hours.
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